Is Garnin better than Tomtom?

[ps56k]

just added the x-post to TT

I bought a Tomtom GPS a while back, and I have found it to be beyond
useless. It's so bad, it tells me to turn into corn fields in the
middle of freeways, and has gone so far as to lead me completely the
wrong way, or down roads that dead end after 10 miles of driving down
rural gravel roads. It's less than a year old, so it's not outdated.
I think the Tomtom is just plain garbage. This past weekend it nearly
went bonkers on me. I knew the route I was traveling, I just had the
Tomtom turned on to see if it lead me the right way. It was so poor
that I have decided to never use it again. I'm going to sell it at
our garage sale, and in all honesty I doubt I'll ever buy another GPS
after this horrible experience. But just for grins, I was told that
Garmin is much better. Is it?

[j***@myplace.com]

On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 15:20:12 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
just added the x-post to TT

And your point is?????

[ps56k]

Post by j***@myplace.com
On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 15:20:12 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
just added the x-post to TT

And your point is?????

sorry -
thought you wanted an intelligent discussion
concerning the pros and cons of GPS devices - Garmin vs TomTom

---
I'm selling my Tomtom One at the next garage sale. It's worthless and
was a waste of money. I'll just sell it for whatever I can get and
take a loss on most of the money I spent. I refuse to let this thing
direct me wrongly and waste my time and gas money. I've changed the
settings, and done all the things needed, and it's proven to be worst
than useless. I've used it for the last time. I've been driving
about 40 years and will use paper maps as I have always done. No more
GPS for me. It's become nothing but a source of annoyance.

Before I sell it, I want to remove all my personal data such as my
"Home" and all the "archives" of recent trips. In other words, I want
to set it back to factory defaults. Is this possible? How? Do I
need to remove the batteries, or let them totally discharge, or is
there another way?

[j***@myplace.com]

On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 18:00:04 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
sorry -
thought you wanted an intelligent discussion
concerning the pros and cons of GPS devices - Garmin vs TomTom

Yes, I do want an intelligent discussion. I'm not trying to make one
brand look better or worse, but I am being honest about my horrid
experience with Tomtom GPSs. I got much less lost and confused when I
had to just rely on the old paper maps. This Tomtom is majorly
f***ked. I can no longer put any trust in it whatsoever, so it's got
to go. I dont need something else to clutter my closet, so I'll take
the few dollars I get at the rummage sale and save it for a better
GPS, or just purchase a new Road Atlas. If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

I guess your cross posting does make sense, so thanks.

JW

[Don Pearce]

Post by j***@myplace.com
On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 18:00:04 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
sorry -
thought you wanted an intelligent discussion
concerning the pros and cons of GPS devices - Garmin vs TomTom

Yes, I do want an intelligent discussion. I'm not trying to make one
brand look better or worse, but I am being honest about my horrid
experience with Tomtom GPSs. I got much less lost and confused when I
had to just rely on the old paper maps. This Tomtom is majorly
f***ked. I can no longer put any trust in it whatsoever, so it's got
to go. I dont need something else to clutter my closet, so I'll take
the few dollars I get at the rummage sale and save it for a better
GPS, or just purchase a new Road Atlas. If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.
I guess your cross posting does make sense, so thanks.
JW

You talk very loftily of honesty, yet you are seeking to sell to some
unsuspecting dupe an item you know to be faulty.

d

[j***@myplace.com]

Post by Don Pearce

Post by j***@myplace.com
On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 18:00:04 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
sorry -
thought you wanted an intelligent discussion
concerning the pros and cons of GPS devices - Garmin vs TomTom

Yes, I do want an intelligent discussion. I'm not trying to make one
brand look better or worse, but I am being honest about my horrid
experience with Tomtom GPSs. I got much less lost and confused when I
had to just rely on the old paper maps. This Tomtom is majorly
f***ked. I can no longer put any trust in it whatsoever, so it's got
to go. I dont need something else to clutter my closet, so I'll take
the few dollars I get at the rummage sale and save it for a better
GPS, or just purchase a new Road Atlas. If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.
I guess your cross posting does make sense, so thanks.
JW

You talk very loftily of honesty, yet you are seeking to sell to some
unsuspecting dupe an item you know to be faulty.
d

Did I say whether I was going to tell the buyer whether this thing
works properly or is defective? NO I DID NOT MENTION IT.
Only an ASS ASSumes what others will do !!!!!

If I put a $5 price tag on it, with a warning "not accurate", it's
still works for knowing what road someone is on. Just kill the speech
(sound) and watch the screen. I just want it out of my life and not
in the closet. If no one pays $5 for it, I'll get $5 worth of stress
relief smashing it with a hammer. That's after I try to salvage the
built in battery, and saving the cord, which may or may not have any
value. This thing has pissed me off more than once, so I might just
smash it to get it gone if we dont have a rummage sale soon.

[Stuart]

Post by j***@myplace.com
If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

My first Satnav was a Garmin - given to me by a friend. Every time I
turned it on it told me my maps were out of date (which is fair enough
because they probably were) but every time I went on the net it said
"there are no updates available".

Every time I deviated from the route it wanted to take, it screamed at me
"RECALCULATING, RECALCULATING" My TomTom just gets on with it quietly and
continues to give me directions.

Every time I wanted to go somewhere it insisted I had to put in a full
address with postcode and house number. Not all houses have numbers,
especially in the country. My TomTom doesn't do that, I can just put in
the name of a town, say, and find a car park. I can browse the map and
just select a point where I want to be. As someone who likes walking in
the hills and open country this is useful as I can just select the
starting point for the walk and it gets me there.

I am on my second TomTom because the first went AWOL but in three years
/only once/ has it made a mistake.

I had been to an exhibition in Birmingham (UK), not a place I normally
drive, and the area was completely unfamiliar to me. It was a dark night
in December and the traffic was very busy. It brought me to a traffic
light controlled junction and told me to turn right. There was a right
turn lane so I moved into it, the filter light turned to green and I made
the turn. It was only as we made the turn that my passenger noticed a
small sign on the opposite side of the road that indicated only buses
could turn right. Why, escapes me, as we were turning onto a road that had
normal two-way traffic and was a busy route in and out of the city.

My advice is to go to the website of any manufacturer you fancy, download
the instruction book for the devices you are interested in and read
carefully what it can do and how to operate it properly before you buy it,
and then make your decision.

[cykelsmeden]

Post by Stuart
My advice is to go to the website of any manufacturer you fancy, download
the instruction book for the devices you are interested in and read
carefully what it can do and how to operate it properly before you buy it,
and then make your decision.

But what fails to inform from instructionbooks, is the ease of use, and
the general feeel. I've been using TomTom as well as Garmin Nüvo, and
the latter stinks in sound (I'm Danish-spoken) as well as in
actuality(updates), - beside the screaming "RECALCULATING" :-)

//finn

[unknown]

Post by Stuart
I had been to an exhibition in Birmingham (UK), not a place I normally
drive, and the area was completely unfamiliar to me. It was a dark
night in December and the traffic was very busy. It brought me to a
traffic light controlled junction and told me to turn right. There
was a right turn lane so I moved into it, the filter light turned to
green and I made the turn. It was only as we made the turn that my
passenger noticed a small sign on the opposite side of the road that
indicated only buses could turn right. Why, escapes me, as we were
turning onto a road that had normal two-way traffic and was a busy
route in and out of the city.

Maybe that right turn is too popular and clogs up the road with vehicles
waiting to filter. Unless restricted to buses. And perhaps the alternative
long way round is not suitable for buses. But there should have been a
warning sign further back; maybe you missed it in watching the traffic...

Mike.

[Sunshine]

Post by Stuart

Post by j***@myplace.com
If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

My first Satnav was a Garmin - given to me by a friend. Every time I
turned it on it told me my maps were out of date (which is fair enough
because they probably were) but every time I went on the net it said
"there are no updates available".

I wouldn't think the online updates would include maps, so the lack of
updates sounds reasonable to me. If you want a newer map, you have to
explicitly buy it.

Post by Stuart
Every time I deviated from the route it wanted to take, it screamed at me
"RECALCULATING, RECALCULATING" My TomTom just gets on with it quietly and
continues to give me directions.

The Nuvi's still say 'Recalculating' (which you can change to
something else if you really want to), but there's no screaming
involved. I doubt if there ever was.

Post by Stuart
Every time I wanted to go somewhere it insisted I had to put in a full
address with postcode and house number. Not all houses have numbers,
especially in the country. My TomTom doesn't do that, I can just put in
the name of a town, say, and find a car park. I can browse the map and
just select a point where I want to be. As someone who likes walking in
the hills and open country this is useful as I can just select the
starting point for the walk and it gets me there.

The Nuvi's do all of that, as well. If you tell it you want to
navigate to an address, naturally it will insist that you enter an
address, but if you only want to navigate to a town, that's fine as
well. It also has a walking mode, just as you described.

[Stuart]

Post by Sunshine
It also has a walking mode, just as you described.

I think you may have misunderstood what I said. I have an e-trex legend
for actually "walking", the TomTom is used to help me /drive/ to the start
of the walk - which may be a layby or roadside verge out in the middle of
no-where.

[Sunshine]

Post by Stuart

Post by Sunshine
It also has a walking mode, just as you described.

I think you may have misunderstood what I said. I have an e-trex legend
for actually "walking", the TomTom is used to help me /drive/ to the start
of the walk - which may be a layby or roadside verge out in the middle of
no-where.

I'm not seeing the problem. The Nuvi is perfectly capable of taking
you to the start of your walking path. If it has an address, you can
find it that way, but even easier, if you can find it on the Nuvi's
map, just tap the display and press Go.

[Stuart]

Post by Sunshine
I'm not seeing the problem. The Nuvi is perfectly capable of taking
you to the start of your walking path. If it has an address, you can
find it that way, but even easier, if you can find it on the Nuvi's
map, just tap the display and press Go.

Good. When you said

Post by Sunshine
It also has a walking mode, just as you described.

I thought you meant it had a walking mode like the TomTom.

That is to say, when you arrive in a car park in a town you can use it to
navigate your way to address on foot. This means it will use roads you
cannot drive down, or pedestrianised areas, to get to your destination.

[Sunshine]

Post by Stuart

Post by Sunshine
I'm not seeing the problem. The Nuvi is perfectly capable of taking
you to the start of your walking path. If it has an address, you can
find it that way, but even easier, if you can find it on the Nuvi's
map, just tap the display and press Go.

Good. When you said

Post by Sunshine
It also has a walking mode, just as you described.

I thought you meant it had a walking mode like the TomTom.
That is to say, when you arrive in a car park in a town you can use it to
navigate your way to address on foot. This means it will use roads you
cannot drive down, or pedestrianised areas, to get to your destination.

Yes, it has that, too.

[Dave Cohen]

Post by j***@myplace.com
If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

Asking the question in a TomTom group reminds me of the scene in 'V for
Vendetta', where the masked man is asked by the woman he has just saved
who he was. He found it a strange question to be put to a man wearing a
mask.
However, to answer your question, they are all very similar and share, I
believe, one of the limited (could be two)data bases available.
Personally I like the TomTom, easy to use and recovers well from a
failure to heed it's instructions. Sometimes turn info could be given a
little sooner, particularly the street name, but again I think they all
do that. There is so much road construction going on in NC that some of
the instructions are just plain wrong, but my daughter's Garmin gave
same incorrect directions.
My advice would be look for a good sale on a basic unit with text to
speech and plan on replacement after a few years. Avoid shortest route
option, although later TomToms will warn when dirt paths are involved.

[j***@myplace.com]

Post by Dave Cohen

Post by j***@myplace.com
If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

Asking the question in a TomTom group reminds me of the scene in 'V for
Vendetta', where the masked man is asked by the woman he has just saved
who he was. He found it a strange question to be put to a man wearing a
mask.
However, to answer your question, they are all very similar and share, I
believe, one of the limited (could be two)data bases available.
Personally I like the TomTom, easy to use and recovers well from a
failure to heed it's instructions. Sometimes turn info could be given a
little sooner, particularly the street name, but again I think they all
do that. There is so much road construction going on in NC that some of
the instructions are just plain wrong, but my daughter's Garmin gave
same incorrect directions.
My advice would be look for a good sale on a basic unit with text to
speech and plan on replacement after a few years. Avoid shortest route
option, although later TomToms will warn when dirt paths are involved.

You know, the more I read these groups and the more I olayed with my
TT, the more I can see that this GPS technology is now yet very
advanced. I guess the advertising for them had me convinced that
these things were almost flawless and would save my time and gas when
I travel. In reality, it looks more like these devices are a good
part of the time just guessing, and if there are new roads, you may as
well not even turn them on. On top of that, getting updated maps is
quite costly. in fact for my TT, it's darn near what I paid for the
initial unit.

Considering this, I think buying a plain old $5 road atlas is not only
much cheaper, but much more reliable. In all honesty, I normally
drive alone, and I was often finding myself pulling over to read a map
or atlas. Now I'm pulling over to program or make sense of my GPS.
That's no improvement, and I have gotten much more lost with it, than
I ever did with a plain old map. So, I asked myself why am I spending
all this money and still wasting my time and gas as much (if not more)
than before.

I think I'm just going to forget about GPSs for a few more years. By
then hopefully the technology will be more accurate and the cost will
also likely come down. I'm very disappointed by my first experience
with a GPS, and if I need to spend a fairly large sum each year to
upgrade it, it's just not worth it to me, especially when the gain or
benefit is not showing. I recall getting lost several times in the
past (without GPS) and may have driven 25 miles out of my way. This
TT caused me to drive 60 miles out of my way a few months ago. I
finally had to get out a paper map to find out that the TT was leading
me entirely wrong. Then when it starts telling me to drive into
parking lots, corn fields, or drive on nonexistant roads, I just say
it's useless.

[Mike Lane]

Post by j***@myplace.com
Yes, I do want an intelligent discussion. I'm not trying to make one
brand look better or worse, but I am being honest about my horrid
experience with Tomtom GPSs. I got much less lost and confused when I
had to just rely on the old paper maps.

[snip]

Post by j***@myplace.com
If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

Well here's one (hopefully honest) reply:

I can't make any direct comparison between the two brands as I've never used
a Tomtom, but I can say that I've used a variety of Garmin units to navigate
all over the UK and western Europe, and had very few errors of any kind.
Occasionally the unit has got traffic regulations wrong (i.e. one-way streets
etc.) and sometimes new road developments are not up to date, but this is
quite rare. Certainly I have *never* had the kind of problems you describe -
being directed onto non-existant roads etc.

*However*, I would not necessarily dismiss Tomtom in favour of Garmin on the
basis of this. With respect, I think that you are confusing two quite
separate issues here. The first is the design of the gps unit itself, and the
second is the accuracy of the mapping data that is installed on the unit, and
I think it is the latter that is the problem in your case. No sat-nav unit
can function properly if the maps are not accurate, and this will vary from
one geographical region to another. My impression is that map data in Europe
is generally a lot more accurate and up-to-date than in the U.S. but I may be
wrong about this.

There are two major organizations producing digital mapping data for satnav
units. The first is Tele Atlas (used by Tomtom) and the other Navteq which is
used by Garmin. It *may* be that Navteq produces more accurate data for your
area than Tele Atlas, in which case a Garmin unit would perform better, but
this is by no means certain.

You should be able to find ou yourself if it is indeed the map data that is
at fault on your unit. There should be some way in which you can browse the
map installed without doing any actual navigation (all Garmin units will
certainly do this). Examine the map on your Tomtom in the exact place where
it directed you along a non-existant road for example. Does the (imaginary)
road exist on the map? If it does, then that is the problem and not the unit
itself.

[ps56k]

Post by Mike Lane

Post by j***@myplace.com
Yes, I do want an intelligent discussion. I'm not trying to make one
brand look better or worse, but I am being honest about my horrid
experience with Tomtom GPSs. I got much less lost and confused when I
had to just rely on the old paper maps.

[snip]

Post by j***@myplace.com
If I hear that Garmin is
reliable, I might get one if I find one on sale. So far I have heard
little bad about Garmin, but I want lots of honest replies. Not just
what the salesman has to say.

I can't make any direct comparison between the two brands as I've never used
a Tomtom, but I can say that I've used a variety of Garmin units to navigate
all over the UK and western Europe, and had very few errors of any kind.
Occasionally the unit has got traffic regulations wrong (i.e. one-way streets
etc.) and sometimes new road developments are not up to date, but this is
quite rare. Certainly I have *never* had the kind of problems you describe -
being directed onto non-existant roads etc.
*However*, I would not necessarily dismiss Tomtom in favour of Garmin on the
basis of this. With respect, I think that you are confusing two quite
separate issues here. The first is the design of the gps unit itself, and the
second is the accuracy of the mapping data that is installed on the unit, and
I think it is the latter that is the problem in your case. No sat-nav unit
can function properly if the maps are not accurate, and this will vary from
one geographical region to another. My impression is that map data in Europe
is generally a lot more accurate and up-to-date than in the U.S. but I may be
wrong about this.
There are two major organizations producing digital mapping data for satnav
units. The first is Tele Atlas (used by Tomtom) and the other Navteq which is
used by Garmin. It *may* be that Navteq produces more accurate data for your
area than Tele Atlas, in which case a Garmin unit would perform better, but
this is by no means certain.
You should be able to find ou yourself if it is indeed the map data that is
at fault on your unit. There should be some way in which you can browse the
map installed without doing any actual navigation (all Garmin units will
certainly do this). Examine the map on your Tomtom in the exact place where
it directed you along a non-existant road for example. Does the (imaginary)
road exist on the map? If it does, then that is the problem and not the unit
itself.
--
Mike Lane
UK North Yorkshire
mike_lane at mac dot com

Glad Mike finally added the point about the 2 different mapping companies...

BTW - it would be helpful if the OP TT user would post their country/zipcode
so we had some idea of where you were driving and the specific TomTom GPS
challenges
you were experiencing in that area.

I've driven all over the Chicago area, driven down to friends in Atlanta &
Florida,
and my Garmin Nuvi has never failed to get me to the destination.
It has taken a few "interesting" paths - like going around the block vs just
turning,
but in most cases all was well.
Recently - on a trip to Germany - Munich - Nuremberg - Berlin - Cologne -
Frankfurt
it did well with the Garmin map I purchased on the micro SD and used.
Again - got lost looking for the Berlin train station parking lot....
my downfall as Garmin took us all around it -

So - as Mike pointed out.... there are two elements to any GPS experience,
just like maybe any other electronic device - the "content" and the
"interface".

[who where]

On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"
<***@interserv.com> wrote:

(snip)

Post by ps56k
I've driven all over the Chicago area, driven down to friends in Atlanta &
Florida,
and my Garmin Nuvi has never failed to get me to the destination.
It has taken a few "interesting" paths - like going around the block vs just
turning,
but in most cases all was well.

(snip rest)

Heh. As foreigners on Vancouver Island, our Nuvi directed us around
the block to our Victoria hotel which was on the road we were using as
we approached. Bit confused by this, until our arrival showed that a
median barrier would have prevented a direct right turn into the hotel
parking area.

But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

[Sunshine]

Post by who where
But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

That's pretty easy thing to change, although I don't have the details
in front of me at the moment. This is a placeholder until someone
comes along with those details.

[who where]

Post by Sunshine

Post by who where
But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

That's pretty easy thing to change, although I don't have the details
in front of me at the moment. This is a placeholder until someone
comes along with those details.

Thanks.

Something like "You lead, I will follow O Master" sounds suitable ;-)
(until THAT gets boring ...)

[Sunshine]

Post by who where

Post by Sunshine

Post by who where
But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

That's pretty easy thing to change, although I don't have the details
in front of me at the moment. This is a placeholder until someone
comes along with those details.

Thanks.
Something like "You lead, I will follow O Master" sounds suitable ;-)
(until THAT gets boring ...)

Will a program called TTSVoiceEditor work for your model?
http://turboccc.wikispaces.com/TTSVoiceEditor

Here's more chatter about it.
http://forums.gpsreview.net/viewtopic.php?t=7824

Google found a bunch more hits for customizing your TTS voices, so
feel free to take a look around.

[who where]

Post by Sunshine

Post by who where

Post by Sunshine

Post by who where
But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

That's pretty easy thing to change, although I don't have the details
in front of me at the moment. This is a placeholder until someone
comes along with those details.

Thanks.
Something like "You lead, I will follow O Master" sounds suitable ;-)
(until THAT gets boring ...)

Will a program called TTSVoiceEditor work for your model?
http://turboccc.wikispaces.com/TTSVoiceEditor

Magic! Yes, it's a listed model (760).

Post by Sunshine
Here's more chatter about it.
http://forums.gpsreview.net/viewtopic.php?t=7824

That was about an hour's reading, but very helpful.

Post by Sunshine
Google found a bunch more hits for customizing your TTS voices, so
feel free to take a look around.

Thanks.

[Sunshine]

Post by who where

Post by Sunshine

Post by who where

Post by Sunshine

Post by who where
But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

That's pretty easy thing to change, although I don't have the details
in front of me at the moment. This is a placeholder until someone
comes along with those details.

Thanks.
Something like "You lead, I will follow O Master" sounds suitable ;-)
(until THAT gets boring ...)

Will a program called TTSVoiceEditor work for your model?
http://turboccc.wikispaces.com/TTSVoiceEditor

Magic! Yes, it's a listed model (760).

Post by Sunshine
Here's more chatter about it.
http://forums.gpsreview.net/viewtopic.php?t=7824

That was about an hour's reading, but very helpful.

Post by Sunshine
Google found a bunch more hits for customizing your TTS voices, so
feel free to take a look around.

Thanks.

Very good, glad to hear it.

[Lon]

Post by who where
On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"
(snip)

Post by ps56k
I've driven all over the Chicago area, driven down to friends in Atlanta &
Florida,
and my Garmin Nuvi has never failed to get me to the destination.
It has taken a few "interesting" paths - like going around the block vs just
turning,
but in most cases all was well.

(snip rest)
Heh. As foreigners on Vancouver Island, our Nuvi directed us around
the block to our Victoria hotel which was on the road we were using as
we approached. Bit confused by this, until our arrival showed that a
median barrier would have prevented a direct right turn into the hotel
parking area.
But I do wish that we could change the irritating "recalculating!"
message on our 760 to something less annoying.

You can. Locate TTSVoiceEditor
Save the original voice, then you can substitute pretty much anything
for "Recalculating"

[j***@myplace.com]

On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
BTW - it would be helpful if the OP TT user would post their country/zipcode
so we had some idea of where you were driving and the specific TomTom GPS
challenges
you were experiencing in that area.

Hey, no problem.

This occurred in the USA, in the state of Wisconsin, city of Mosinee.
I was traveling from another part of Wisconsin and heading to
Caroline, WI.

I turned off of a major freeway, Hwy 39 / 51. I turned right onto Hwy
153. Less than one mile from this freeway, (still on 153), I was
instructed to turn right into the parking lot of a factory (or the
water company), and make an immediate left (this made no sense at
all). I stayed on 153, going EAST thru Peplin, Bevent, Elderon, and
to to Whitcomb. There I turned Right onto Hwy 45 to Tigerton. In
Tigerton, I turned Left on Hwy M. Immediately after this turn, I was
instructed to turn Right and make then make another right. (that
would have taken me into the parking lot of a BP Gas Station. (of
course I ignored that too). I continued going East on Hwy M toward
Caroline. As I was entering the edge of Caroline, I was instructed
*three times* to make a Left into cornfields (there are no side roads
there at all).
Thats when I shut off the GPS because it was annoying me, and I was
entering my destination anyhow, (the Town of Caroline, Wisconsin).

This can be viewed on Mapquest. Set it for Elderon (mid point),
Total distance from Mosinee to Caroline is around 40 to 50 miles.
All these errors occurred in this stretch of roads.

I did get a few other errors prior to this, but I was on a newly built
section of road at the time, so I ignored that. But Hwy 153, 45, and
M are all old roads that have been there for many years. There was no
excuse for these errors.

I should note that this is not the first time this TT has completely
gone bonkers on me.

[ps56k]

Post by who where
On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
BTW - it would be helpful if the OP TT user would post their
country/zipcode
so we had some idea of where you were driving and the specific TomTom GPS
challenges
you were experiencing in that area.

Hey, no problem.
This occurred in the USA, in the state of Wisconsin, city of Mosinee.
I was traveling from another part of Wisconsin and heading to
Caroline, WI.
I turned off of a major freeway, Hwy 39 / 51. I turned right onto Hwy
153. Less than one mile from this freeway, (still on 153), I was
instructed to turn right into the parking lot of a factory (or the
water company), and make an immediate left (this made no sense at
all). I stayed on 153, going EAST thru Peplin, Bevent, Elderon, and
to to Whitcomb. There I turned Right onto Hwy 45 to Tigerton. In
Tigerton, I turned Left on Hwy M. Immediately after this turn, I was
instructed to turn Right and make then make another right. (that
would have taken me into the parking lot of a BP Gas Station. (of
course I ignored that too). I continued going East on Hwy M toward
Caroline. As I was entering the edge of Caroline, I was instructed
*three times* to make a Left into cornfields (there are no side roads
there at all).
Thats when I shut off the GPS because it was annoying me, and I was
entering my destination anyhow, (the Town of Caroline, Wisconsin).
This can be viewed on Mapquest. Set it for Elderon (mid point),
Total distance from Mosinee to Caroline is around 40 to 50 miles.
All these errors occurred in this stretch of roads.
I did get a few other errors prior to this, but I was on a newly built
section of road at the time, so I ignored that. But Hwy 153, 45, and
M are all old roads that have been there for many years. There was no
excuse for these errors.
I should note that this is not the first time this TT has completely
gone bonkers on me.

interesting trip....
We have a son in college at UW Madison,
and were visiting a little SE in a town called Evansville.
Garmin GPS had no problem getting from Madison -> Evansville.
Then, we headed out for Milwaukee & Marquette...
The Garmin had us on all the backroads and I had no idea where we were,
but it got us to Milwaukee and the Univ with no problems.
So, for us, it works on the major roads, the backroads,
and even in walking mode over in Germany trying to locate our hotel
from the train station...... though that was painful due to hand
orientation.

[TR Oltrogge]

Post by who where
On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"

<snip>

Post by who where
I turned off of a major freeway, Hwy 39 / 51. I turned right onto Hwy
153. Less than one mile from this freeway, (still on 153), I was
instructed to turn right into the parking lot of a factory (or the
water company), and make an immediate left (this made no sense at
all). I stayed on 153, going EAST thru Peplin, Bevent, Elderon, and
to to Whitcomb. There I turned Right onto Hwy 45 to Tigerton. In
Tigerton, I turned Left on Hwy M. Immediately after this turn, I was
instructed to turn Right and make then make another right. (that
would have taken me into the parking lot of a BP Gas Station. (of
course I ignored that too). I continued going East on Hwy M toward
Caroline. As I was entering the edge of Caroline, I was instructed
*three times* to make a Left into cornfields (there are no side roads
there at all).
Thats when I shut off the GPS because it was annoying me, and I was
entering my destination anyhow, (the Town of Caroline, Wisconsin).

I used my TomTom XL340S to take a look at the roads you mentioned and saw no
problem with the maps versus Google Earth. I purchased my unit November 2009
and enjoy it. I always use "Fastest Route" rather than "Shortest Route" to
make sure it doesn't push me down side streets and complicate matters. I
believe this is the default so this probably wasn't your trouble. I did see
on Wisconsin 153 the road is a divided highway for the first half mile east
of I-39. Since eastern- and western-bound lanes are only separated by a few
feet maybe your TomTom (whose position accuracy seems to be on the order of
30 feet) somehow thought you were eastbound on 153 "in the westbound lanes"
and wanted you to take a quick jog on one of the two crossovers I see near
the airport to get you onto the east-bound lanes. I'm actually amazed at how
well these GPS units seem to know where you are and sync you to the closest
road and direction. I have no theory on your turn onto County Road M or the
"cornfields" just west of Caroline. I agree, I would be very frustrated at
deciphering what was happening and would tempt to call the technology "not
ready for prime time" if it happened to me.

I used to program computers for a living so I view my GPS as a piece of
software. Consequently, it took me maybe four or five months of periodic
usage of the device to get all the information I felt I needed from its
display and voice. I have a tendency to "reverse-engineer" the software in
equipment so I feel I get the best usage of it. Since my XL340S has a wide
display I have changed from the default layout to one where the turn
instructions are displayed on the right edge of the screen and the map is
pretty much squarish on the left side of the screen. I turn off the 3D view
and use 2D straight-down viewing because it seems to give me more roads and
text displaying crossroad street names this way.

My XL340S screen displays 5 pieces of crucial information while driving

(1) Your next turn in the upper-right of the screen. This is an arrow
showing left or right turns ranging from a slight jog to 90-degree to acute
angle.

(2) The distance to this next turn in feet or miles, depending on how close
you are.

(3) The name of the next road you are supposed to turn onto displayed at the
very top of the screen. I have noticed this text can *momentarily* change to
give you assurance as you approach a "choice" in a road even though items
(1) and (2) remain the same.

(4) The current road you are on *and* your direction (NB, SB, EB, WB) at the
very bottom of the screen. If you forget what road you're on, look at this!
If this doesn't agree with what you know you are doing then the GPS is
probably going to replan and "surprise" you. Personally, I don't believe
I've ever seen a discrepancy on my unit, but it's got to happen sometime due
to accuracy limitations either in the map, the satellite reception, or a
road detour (like lane shift due to construction).

(5) The graphical road display itself with the route you're supposed to take
*highlighted* in a maroon color. This highlighting is quite valuable in
preparing for obeying items (1) and (2).

The voice uses items (1) (2) and (3) to speak instructions. If you have been
checking these items beforehand the voice virtually never surprises you with
its instructions.

I know I'm not your average user, but my mind tries to take in all five of
these fields on the screen so I can "keep ahead" of the GPS and avoid
surprises.

Tim

[j***@myplace.com]

On Sat, 9 Oct 2010 14:02:17 -0400, "TR Oltrogge"

Post by TR Oltrogge

Post by who where
On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"

<snip>

Post by who where
I turned off of a major freeway, Hwy 39 / 51. I turned right onto Hwy
153. Less than one mile from this freeway, (still on 153), I was
instructed to turn right into the parking lot of a factory (or the
water company), and make an immediate left (this made no sense at
all). I stayed on 153, going EAST thru Peplin, Bevent, Elderon, and
to to Whitcomb. There I turned Right onto Hwy 45 to Tigerton. In
Tigerton, I turned Left on Hwy M. Immediately after this turn, I was
instructed to turn Right and make then make another right. (that
would have taken me into the parking lot of a BP Gas Station. (of
course I ignored that too). I continued going East on Hwy M toward
Caroline. As I was entering the edge of Caroline, I was instructed
*three times* to make a Left into cornfields (there are no side roads
there at all).
Thats when I shut off the GPS because it was annoying me, and I was
entering my destination anyhow, (the Town of Caroline, Wisconsin).

I used my TomTom XL340S to take a look at the roads you mentioned and saw no
problem with the maps versus Google Earth. I purchased my unit November 2009
and enjoy it. I always use "Fastest Route" rather than "Shortest Route" to
make sure it doesn't push me down side streets and complicate matters. I
believe this is the default so this probably wasn't your trouble. I did see
on Wisconsin 153 the road is a divided highway for the first half mile east
of I-39. Since eastern- and western-bound lanes are only separated by a few
feet maybe your TomTom (whose position accuracy seems to be on the order of
30 feet) somehow thought you were eastbound on 153 "in the westbound lanes"
and wanted you to take a quick jog on one of the two crossovers I see near
the airport to get you onto the east-bound lanes. I'm actually amazed at how
well these GPS units seem to know where you are and sync you to the closest
road and direction. I have no theory on your turn onto County Road M or the
"cornfields" just west of Caroline. I agree, I would be very frustrated at
deciphering what was happening and would tempt to call the technology "not
ready for prime time" if it happened to me.
I used to program computers for a living so I view my GPS as a piece of
software. Consequently, it took me maybe four or five months of periodic
usage of the device to get all the information I felt I needed from its
display and voice. I have a tendency to "reverse-engineer" the software in
equipment so I feel I get the best usage of it. Since my XL340S has a wide
display I have changed from the default layout to one where the turn
instructions are displayed on the right edge of the screen and the map is
pretty much squarish on the left side of the screen. I turn off the 3D view
and use 2D straight-down viewing because it seems to give me more roads and
text displaying crossroad street names this way.
My XL340S screen displays 5 pieces of crucial information while driving
(1) Your next turn in the upper-right of the screen. This is an arrow
showing left or right turns ranging from a slight jog to 90-degree to acute
angle.
(2) The distance to this next turn in feet or miles, depending on how close
you are.
(3) The name of the next road you are supposed to turn onto displayed at the
very top of the screen. I have noticed this text can *momentarily* change to
give you assurance as you approach a "choice" in a road even though items
(1) and (2) remain the same.
(4) The current road you are on *and* your direction (NB, SB, EB, WB) at the
very bottom of the screen. If you forget what road you're on, look at this!
If this doesn't agree with what you know you are doing then the GPS is
probably going to replan and "surprise" you. Personally, I don't believe
I've ever seen a discrepancy on my unit, but it's got to happen sometime due
to accuracy limitations either in the map, the satellite reception, or a
road detour (like lane shift due to construction).
(5) The graphical road display itself with the route you're supposed to take
*highlighted* in a maroon color. This highlighting is quite valuable in
preparing for obeying items (1) and (2).
The voice uses items (1) (2) and (3) to speak instructions. If you have been
checking these items beforehand the voice virtually never surprises you with
its instructions.
I know I'm not your average user, but my mind tries to take in all five of
these fields on the screen so I can "keep ahead" of the GPS and avoid
surprises.
Tim

Seems like you're TT is better than mine. I'm guessing it's a more
costly model. Like, I can not eliminate gravel roads on mine.

Yes, 153 is multi lane just east of I-39, and that's where that first
problem occurred. Seems like after that it just went bonkers on me.

I will say one thing. Shortly before that all happened I was on a new
stretch of highway 10 (south of 153 and built in the past year). On
there I was getting some screwy instructions to turn where there were
no roads, and being a freeway, there are no minor roads to turn on.
Before that new highway was built, the land was farm land, and
probably woods and such. Anyhow, I knew to ignore all directions when
on that new highway. Now, I'm wondering, could it be that my GPS got
so confused by that new highway that it never recovered during the
rest of my trip? Just a thought!!!! Seems to me that it should
recover once it's back on older existing roads, and it DID tell me to
get off on 153 from I-39. Juat a thought, I dont know ?????

Thanks

[j***@myplace.com]

On Sat, 9 Oct 2010 14:02:17 -0400, "TR Oltrogge"

Post by TR Oltrogge

Post by who where
On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 15:15:45 -0500, "ps56k"

<snip>

Post by who where
I turned off of a major freeway, Hwy 39 / 51. I turned right onto Hwy
153. Less than one mile from this freeway, (still on 153), I was
instructed to turn right into the parking lot of a factory (or the
water company), and make an immediate left (this made no sense at
all). I stayed on 153, going EAST thru Peplin, Bevent, Elderon, and
to to Whitcomb. There I turned Right onto Hwy 45 to Tigerton. In
Tigerton, I turned Left on Hwy M. Immediately after this turn, I was
instructed to turn Right and make then make another right. (that
would have taken me into the parking lot of a BP Gas Station. (of
course I ignored that too). I continued going East on Hwy M toward
Caroline. As I was entering the edge of Caroline, I was instructed
*three times* to make a Left into cornfields (there are no side roads
there at all).
Thats when I shut off the GPS because it was annoying me, and I was
entering my destination anyhow, (the Town of Caroline, Wisconsin).

I used my TomTom XL340S to take a look at the roads you mentioned and saw no
problem with the maps versus Google Earth. I purchased my unit November 2009
and enjoy it. I always use "Fastest Route" rather than "Shortest Route" to
make sure it doesn't push me down side streets and complicate matters. I
believe this is the default so this probably wasn't your trouble. I did see
on Wisconsin 153 the road is a divided highway for the first half mile east
of I-39. Since eastern- and western-bound lanes are only separated by a few
feet maybe your TomTom (whose position accuracy seems to be on the order of
30 feet) somehow thought you were eastbound on 153 "in the westbound lanes"
and wanted you to take a quick jog on one of the two crossovers I see near
the airport to get you onto the east-bound lanes. I'm actually amazed at how
well these GPS units seem to know where you are and sync you to the closest
road and direction. I have no theory on your turn onto County Road M or the
"cornfields" just west of Caroline. I agree, I would be very frustrated at
deciphering what was happening and would tempt to call the technology "not
ready for prime time" if it happened to me.
I used to program computers for a living so I view my GPS as a piece of
software. Consequently, it took me maybe four or five months of periodic
usage of the device to get all the information I felt I needed from its
display and voice. I have a tendency to "reverse-engineer" the software in
equipment so I feel I get the best usage of it. Since my XL340S has a wide
display I have changed from the default layout to one where the turn
instructions are displayed on the right edge of the screen and the map is
pretty much squarish on the left side of the screen. I turn off the 3D view
and use 2D straight-down viewing because it seems to give me more roads and
text displaying crossroad street names this way.
My XL340S screen displays 5 pieces of crucial information while driving
(1) Your next turn in the upper-right of the screen. This is an arrow
showing left or right turns ranging from a slight jog to 90-degree to acute
angle.
(2) The distance to this next turn in feet or miles, depending on how close
you are.
(3) The name of the next road you are supposed to turn onto displayed at the
very top of the screen. I have noticed this text can *momentarily* change to
give you assurance as you approach a "choice" in a road even though items
(1) and (2) remain the same.
(4) The current road you are on *and* your direction (NB, SB, EB, WB) at the
very bottom of the screen. If you forget what road you're on, look at this!
If this doesn't agree with what you know you are doing then the GPS is
probably going to replan and "surprise" you. Personally, I don't believe
I've ever seen a discrepancy on my unit, but it's got to happen sometime due
to accuracy limitations either in the map, the satellite reception, or a
road detour (like lane shift due to construction).
(5) The graphical road display itself with the route you're supposed to take
*highlighted* in a maroon color. This highlighting is quite valuable in
preparing for obeying items (1) and (2).
The voice uses items (1) (2) and (3) to speak instructions. If you have been
checking these items beforehand the voice virtually never surprises you with
its instructions.
I know I'm not your average user, but my mind tries to take in all five of
these fields on the screen so I can "keep ahead" of the GPS and avoid
surprises.
Tim

Seems like you're TT is better than mine. I'm guessing it's a more
costly model. Like, I can not eliminate gravel roads on mine.

Yes, 153 is multi lane just east of I-39, and that's where that first
problem occurred. Seems like after that it just went bonkers on me.

I will say one thing. Shortly before that all happened I was on a new
stretch of highway 10 (south of 153 and built in the past year). On
there I was getting some screwy instructions to turn where there were
no roads, and being a freeway, there are no minor roads to turn on.
Before that new highway was built, the land was farm land, and
probably woods and such. Anyhow, I knew to ignore all directions when
on that new highway. Now, I'm wondering, could it be that my GPS got
so confused by that new highway that it never recovered during the
rest of my trip? Just a thought!!!! Seems to me that it should
recover once it's back on older existing roads, and it DID tell me to
get off on 153 from I-39. Juat a thought, I dont know ?????

Thanks

[TR Oltrogge]

Post by TR Oltrogge
<snip>
Seems like you're TT is better than mine. I'm guessing it's a more
costly model. Like, I can not eliminate gravel roads on mine.
<snip>
Thanks

Luckily, I bought mine on "Black Friday 2009" at Target for $97! :)

Yes, mine allows me to eliminate unpaved roads.

Tim

[j***@myplace.com]

On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 09:26:11 -0400, "TR Oltrogge"

Post by TR Oltrogge
Luckily, I bought mine on "Black Friday 2009" at Target for $97! :)
Yes, mine allows me to eliminate unpaved roads.
Tim

I bought mine on the same day in 09 at Walmart for around $80. Now I
wish I had gone to Target instead. But I knew nothing about these
things prior to that date, other than one time riding in a car while a
guy used one. His was a Tomtom and he said he liked it. I dont know
which model he had, but it was about the same size as mine. I
originally thought they were all about the same except screen size.

Because I live in a rural area where there are unpaved roads
everywhere, I am constantly bombarded with instructions to take them.
Just on the way to the next town (about 20 miles), it tells me six
times to take those damn curvy dusty and nasty gravel roads where I'm
always hitting the brakes because of sharp curves. I have it set to
FASTEST ROUTE and I can guarantee these gravel roads are NOT even
close to being the fastest, when I'm braking all the time and never
exceeding 45mph. One time I followed the TT on this route, and it was
at most, one mile shorter, but it took LONGER than just taking the two
paved highways to that town. doing 55 all the way, with only on stop
sign at that intersection. I know this route and know which roads to
take, but when I really NEED a GPS, and it tells me to take an unpaved
road, I'm forced to just stay on the paved road and hope I'm doing the
right thing, or pull over and reprogram the damn thing for an
alternate route. This is about the time I pull out a map and say the
hell with the GPS, which renders it useless.

Just recently I pulled over to reprogram it because of a gravel road,
I clicked to eliminate that road. My trip then went from being a
total of a 5.5 hour trip to a 7.3 hour trip. I looked at the route,
and it wanted me to actually go a totally different way, going thru a
large city and rediculous route. I got out my map, found I could go
another 3.5 miles to a small town, and catch the next paved road. It
looked like I'd have to go about an additional 5 miles total by
eliminating that gravel road. I saw that gravel road on the map, and
it looked like a shortcut, so I took it. What a miserable curvy road,
and at night, I was slowing down to 25mph almost the whole way because
of the curves and several deer that ran across the road. That gravel
road was almost 4 miles long, so I really only saved 2 miles at most,
and know in the end I lost time.

[Sunshine]

Post by j***@myplace.com
I bought mine on the same day in 09 at Walmart for around $80. Now I
wish I had gone to Target instead. But I knew nothing about these
things prior to that date, other than one time riding in a car while a
guy used one. His was a Tomtom and he said he liked it. I dont know
which model he had, but it was about the same size as mine. I
originally thought they were all about the same except screen size.
Because I live in a rural area where there are unpaved roads
everywhere, I am constantly bombarded with instructions to take them.
Just on the way to the next town (about 20 miles), it tells me six
times to take those damn curvy dusty and nasty gravel roads where I'm
always hitting the brakes because of sharp curves. I have it set to
FASTEST ROUTE and I can guarantee these gravel roads are NOT even
close to being the fastest, when I'm braking all the time and never
exceeding 45mph. One time I followed the TT on this route, and it was
at most, one mile shorter, but it took LONGER than just taking the two
paved highways to that town. doing 55 all the way, with only on stop
sign at that intersection. I know this route and know which roads to
take, but when I really NEED a GPS, and it tells me to take an unpaved
road, I'm forced to just stay on the paved road and hope I'm doing the
right thing, or pull over and reprogram the damn thing for an
alternate route. This is about the time I pull out a map and say the
hell with the GPS, which renders it useless.
Just recently I pulled over to reprogram it because of a gravel road,
I clicked to eliminate that road. My trip then went from being a
total of a 5.5 hour trip to a 7.3 hour trip. I looked at the route,
and it wanted me to actually go a totally different way, going thru a
large city and rediculous route. I got out my map, found I could go
another 3.5 miles to a small town, and catch the next paved road. It
looked like I'd have to go about an additional 5 miles total by
eliminating that gravel road. I saw that gravel road on the map, and
it looked like a shortcut, so I took it. What a miserable curvy road,
and at night, I was slowing down to 25mph almost the whole way because
of the curves and several deer that ran across the road. That gravel
road was almost 4 miles long, so I really only saved 2 miles at most,
and know in the end I lost time.

Two possibilities come to mind:
1. You have an obviously defective unit and you're basing your
feelings toward GPS receivers on that single unit.
2. Some people are digital, others are analog. You might be analog.

[Dave Cohen]

Post by Sunshine

Post by j***@myplace.com
I bought mine on the same day in 09 at Walmart for around $80. Now I
wish I had gone to Target instead. But I knew nothing about these
things prior to that date, other than one time riding in a car while a
guy used one. His was a Tomtom and he said he liked it. I dont know
which model he had, but it was about the same size as mine. I
originally thought they were all about the same except screen size.
Because I live in a rural area where there are unpaved roads
everywhere, I am constantly bombarded with instructions to take them.
Just on the way to the next town (about 20 miles), it tells me six
times to take those damn curvy dusty and nasty gravel roads where I'm
always hitting the brakes because of sharp curves. I have it set to
FASTEST ROUTE and I can guarantee these gravel roads are NOT even
close to being the fastest, when I'm braking all the time and never
exceeding 45mph. One time I followed the TT on this route, and it was
at most, one mile shorter, but it took LONGER than just taking the two
paved highways to that town. doing 55 all the way, with only on stop
sign at that intersection. I know this route and know which roads to
take, but when I really NEED a GPS, and it tells me to take an unpaved
road, I'm forced to just stay on the paved road and hope I'm doing the
right thing, or pull over and reprogram the damn thing for an
alternate route. This is about the time I pull out a map and say the
hell with the GPS, which renders it useless.
Just recently I pulled over to reprogram it because of a gravel road,
I clicked to eliminate that road. My trip then went from being a
total of a 5.5 hour trip to a 7.3 hour trip. I looked at the route,
and it wanted me to actually go a totally different way, going thru a
large city and rediculous route. I got out my map, found I could go
another 3.5 miles to a small town, and catch the next paved road. It
looked like I'd have to go about an additional 5 miles total by
eliminating that gravel road. I saw that gravel road on the map, and
it looked like a shortcut, so I took it. What a miserable curvy road,
and at night, I was slowing down to 25mph almost the whole way because
of the curves and several deer that ran across the road. That gravel
road was almost 4 miles long, so I really only saved 2 miles at most,
and know in the end I lost time.

1. You have an obviously defective unit and you're basing your
feelings toward GPS receivers on that single unit.
2. Some people are digital, others are analog. You might be analog.

You've neglected to list a third possibility, actually two more. The guy
might just be trolling or the other alternative, make up your own mind
about the other one in whatever order you choose.
Of course, as already suggested, if in fact one lives in an area where
the only roads are dirt roads, no GPS unit can help. But then an
individual in such a situation wouldn't need any help to figure this
out, unless of course he fell into one of the two aforementioned categories.

[Ex-Alcoholic#]

Post by Dave Cohen
You've neglected to list a third possibility, actually two more. The guy
might just be trolling or the other alternative, make up your own mind
about the other one in whatever order you choose.
Of course, as already suggested, if in fact one lives in an area where
the only roads are dirt roads, no GPS unit can help. But then an
individual in such a situation wouldn't need any help to figure this
out, unless of course he fell into one of the two aforementioned categories.

I DID NOT say the *ONLY* roads were dirt roads. There are paved
(mostly single lane) highways and even a few lesser roads. But most
of the smaller roads are gravel and only go to residents or farms.
Where I live, is a very hilly area, and there are few straight roads.
Most were at one time just access roads to a couple farms, but
eventually they got taken care of by the counties and became actual
roads. But they're still very crooked and hilly, not to mention the
amount of deer on the road these days. You just dont drive over 35 on
them, and often slower on sharp curves.

There is one town nearby where I always laugh when I drive thru. It's
a paved single lane road which is 55 until it gets into the small
town. Then it drops to 40mph. Just exiting the town, there's a 55mph
sign, and less than 50 feet further there's a 40mph sign because of a
curve in the road. I never understood that !!!!! You cant even get
up to 55 that quickly, and then you got to slow down again. I swear
whoever put up those signs was either drunk, or had a strange sense of
humor....

[Rod Speed]

Post by Sunshine

Post by j***@myplace.com
I bought mine on the same day in 09 at Walmart for around $80. Now I
wish I had gone to Target instead. But I knew nothing about these
things prior to that date, other than one time riding in a car while
a guy used one. His was a Tomtom and he said he liked it. I dont
know which model he had, but it was about the same size as mine. I
originally thought they were all about the same except screen size.
Because I live in a rural area where there are unpaved roads
everywhere, I am constantly bombarded with instructions to take them.
Just on the way to the next town (about 20 miles), it tells me six
times to take those damn curvy dusty and nasty gravel roads where I'm
always hitting the brakes because of sharp curves. I have it set to
FASTEST ROUTE and I can guarantee these gravel roads are NOT even
close to being the fastest, when I'm braking all the time and never
exceeding 45mph. One time I followed the TT on this route, and it
was at most, one mile shorter, but it took LONGER than just taking
the two paved highways to that town. doing 55 all the way, with only
on stop sign at that intersection. I know this route and know which
roads to take, but when I really NEED a GPS, and it tells me to take
an unpaved road, I'm forced to just stay on the paved road and hope
I'm doing the right thing, or pull over and reprogram the damn thing
for an alternate route. This is about the time I pull out a map and
say the hell with the GPS, which renders it useless.
Just recently I pulled over to reprogram it because of a gravel road,
I clicked to eliminate that road. My trip then went from being a
total of a 5.5 hour trip to a 7.3 hour trip. I looked at the route,
and it wanted me to actually go a totally different way, going thru a
large city and rediculous route. I got out my map, found I could go
another 3.5 miles to a small town, and catch the next paved road. It
looked like I'd have to go about an additional 5 miles total by
eliminating that gravel road. I saw that gravel road on the map, and
it looked like a shortcut, so I took it. What a miserable curvy
road, and at night, I was slowing down to 25mph almost the whole way
because of the curves and several deer that ran across the road.
That gravel road was almost 4 miles long, so I really only saved 2
miles at most, and know in the end I lost time.

1. You have an obviously defective unit and you're basing your
feelings toward GPS receivers on that single unit.
2. Some people are digital, others are analog. You might be analog.

The real possibility, he's just another stupid troll and you are too stupid to even notice.

[Anthony R. Gold]

Post by Rod Speed
The real possibility, he's just another stupid troll and you are too stupid to even notice.

When Rod is not taking his anger management medication everyone is a troll or
stupid or a liar or some combination. I am sure I am all three right now :-)

Tony

[j***@myplace.com]

On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 23:05:45 +0100, "Anthony R. Gold"

Post by Anthony R. Gold

Post by Rod Speed
The real possibility, he's just another stupid troll and you are too stupid to even notice.

When Rod is not taking his anger management medication everyone is a troll or
stupid or a liar or some combination. I am sure I am all three right now :-)
Tony

Had I been paying more attention to the user name, I would not have
even replied. Actually I thought I had Rod filtered so I do not see
his useless messages on ANY newsgroup. That guy seems to pop up on
every newsgroup, and has nothing useful to add, ever. Guess I better
check my filters.

Yea, I forgot to change my user name too on this computer, but I am
the OP regardless of user name. Too many computers and they are not
synchronized.

[Rod Speed]

Post by Anthony R. Gold

Post by Rod Speed
The real possibility, he's just another stupid
troll and you are too stupid to even notice.

When Rod is not taking his anger management medication
everyone is a troll or stupid or a liar or some combination.

Everyone can see for themselves that I have only said that
THAT clown is an obvious troll. Check the headers, stupid.

Post by Anthony R. Gold
I am sure I am all three right now :-)

Nope, just too stupid to check the troll's headers.

[LightByrd]

Post by Rod Speed

Post by Anthony R. Gold

Post by Rod Speed
The real possibility, he's just another stupid
troll and you are too stupid to even notice.

When Rod is not taking his anger management medication
everyone is a troll or stupid or a liar or some combination.

Everyone can see for themselves that I have only said that
THAT clown is an obvious troll. Check the headers, stupid.

Post by Anthony R. Gold
I am sure I am all three right now :-)

Nope, just too stupid to check the troll's headers.

Check the stupid cross posting too!!

[Rod Speed]

Post by LightByrd

Post by Rod Speed

Post by Anthony R. Gold

Post by Rod Speed
The real possibility, he's just another stupid
troll and you are too stupid to even notice.

When Rod is not taking his anger management medication
everyone is a troll or stupid or a liar or some combination.

Everyone can see for themselves that I have only said that
THAT clown is an obvious troll. Check the headers, stupid.

Post by Anthony R. Gold
I am sure I am all three right now :-)

Nope, just too stupid to check the troll's headers.

Check the stupid cross posting too!!

And that troll's previous posts.

[TR Oltrogge]

<***@myplace.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
<snip>

Post by j***@myplace.com
I bought mine on the same day in 09 at Walmart for around $80. Now I
wish I had gone to Target instead. But I knew nothing about these
things prior to that date, other than one time riding in a car while a
guy used one. His was a Tomtom and he said he liked it. I dont know
which model he had, but it was about the same size as mine. I
originally thought they were all about the same except screen size.
Because I live in a rural area where there are unpaved roads
everywhere, I am constantly bombarded with instructions to take them.
Just on the way to the next town (about 20 miles), it tells me six
times to take those damn curvy dusty and nasty gravel roads where I'm
always hitting the brakes because of sharp curves. I have it set to
FASTEST ROUTE and I can guarantee these gravel roads are NOT even
close to being the fastest, when I'm braking all the time and never
exceeding 45mph. One time I followed the TT on this route, and it was
at most, one mile shorter, but it took LONGER than just taking the two
paved highways to that town. doing 55 all the way, with only on stop
sign at that intersection. I know this route and know which roads to
take, but when I really NEED a GPS, and it tells me to take an unpaved
road, I'm forced to just stay on the paved road and hope I'm doing the
right thing, or pull over and reprogram the damn thing for an
alternate route. This is about the time I pull out a map and say the
hell with the GPS, which renders it useless.
Just recently I pulled over to reprogram it because of a gravel road,
I clicked to eliminate that road. My trip then went from being a
total of a 5.5 hour trip to a 7.3 hour trip. I looked at the route,
and it wanted me to actually go a totally different way, going thru a
large city and rediculous route. I got out my map, found I could go
another 3.5 miles to a small town, and catch the next paved road. It
looked like I'd have to go about an additional 5 miles total by
eliminating that gravel road. I saw that gravel road on the map, and
it looked like a shortcut, so I took it. What a miserable curvy road,
and at night, I was slowing down to 25mph almost the whole way because
of the curves and several deer that ran across the road. That gravel
road was almost 4 miles long, so I really only saved 2 miles at most,
and know in the end I lost time.

Where I live in western Pennsylvania there are few gravel roads. I suspect
you live in the midwest where there are lots of them. If your TomTom assumes
the shortest route should pretty much be the fastest then it's going to
suggest those gravel roads too much.

Now my unit has what is called "IQ Routing." This is average speeds to be
expected on road segments based on other customer's experiences. Whenever I
connect my GPS to my computer the trips I've taken, including the exact
roads, time-of-day, and average calculated speed on road segments, is
transmitted to TomTom so they can update the map data for all their
customers. My guess is that these average speed statistics are stored right
in the map data. That means you need a map that's reasonably up-to-date (two
years or newer?) along with GPS software that *actually uses* those
statistics (a newer, or more expensive, unit?).

I've been quite pleased. This spring we were traveling in Colorado from Mesa
Verde in the southwest corner along U.S. 160 east heading for U.S. 285 to
get to Denver. Having never gone this way before I looked at the paper map
and felt I should simply take Route 160 all the way to Monte Vista and pick
up Route 285 there. So I was surprised when the GPS told me to turn
northeast 15 miles sooner at Del Norte onto Colorado 112. I did so, and
found a wonderful straight, level, high speed, virtually empty road that cut
12 miles off a 25 mile route and incurred no speed loss. I felt like I had
almost "cheated"!

Tim

[divoch]

Post by TR Oltrogge
<snip>
Where I live in western Pennsylvania there are few gravel roads. I suspect
you live in the midwest where there are lots of them. If your TomTom
assumes the shortest route should pretty much be the fastest then it's
going to suggest those gravel roads too much.
Now my unit has what is called "IQ Routing." This is average speeds to be
expected on road segments based on other customer's experiences. Whenever
I connect my GPS to my computer the trips I've taken, including the exact
roads, time-of-day, and average calculated speed on road segments, is
transmitted to TomTom so they can update the map data for all their
customers. My guess is that these average speed statistics are stored
right in the map data. That means you need a map that's reasonably
up-to-date (two years or newer?) along with GPS software that *actually
uses* those statistics (a newer, or more expensive, unit?).
I've been quite pleased. This spring we were traveling in Colorado from
Mesa Verde in the southwest corner along U.S. 160 east heading for U.S.
285 to get to Denver. Having never gone this way before I looked at the
paper map and felt I should simply take Route 160 all the way to Monte
Vista and pick up Route 285 there. So I was surprised when the GPS told me
to turn northeast 15 miles sooner at Del Norte onto Colorado 112. I did
so, and found a wonderful straight, level, high speed, virtually empty
road that cut 12 miles off a 25 mile route and incurred no speed loss. I
felt like I had almost "cheated"!

I live in UK and have TomTom One V.3. It is quite basic unit but I found it
mostly very useful in the UK and the whole of Europe. In the areas where
there have not been "recent" major changes in the road layouts it is pretty
good because it gets updated by users. However, this is limited to things
like direction of one way streets or blocked roads. There is no way
individual users could update major layout changes and that is where the
problem is. From my experience the maps as there are updated and issued are
already at least 6 months out of date by the time of issue. There was an
extensive change of road layout on driving from Cambridge(UK) to Bedford and
it took about 9 months, for the maps to catch up . I know that because I
was insisting that I want to buy new map but only when this part of the road
will be up to date and only when TomTom confirmed that it is up to date I
bought it. During this time I was "driving in the fields" for part of the
journey. If you bought TomTom or map for it a year ago then you may be
almost two years out of date. I am now subscribed to map updates and I get
one new map every quarter. It is not cheap but at least the lag is not so
great as to make the device unusable.

To sum it up: If kept up to date as possible (which is inevitably already
out of date), then in most cases I find it very useful, particularly driving
abroad or through unknown large towns. Question to which I would like to
know the answer is whether Garmin provides any more up to date maps. If not
then I shall stick with my TomTom.



divoch

[Macker]

Post by ps56k

Post by j***@myplace.com
On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 15:20:12 -0500, "ps56k"

Post by ps56k
just added the x-post to TT

And your point is?????

sorry -
thought you wanted an intelligent discussion
concerning the pros and cons of GPS devices - Garmin vs TomTom
---
I'm selling my Tomtom One at the next garage sale. It's worthless and
was a waste of money. I'll just sell it for whatever I can get and
take a loss on most of the money I spent. I refuse to let this thing
direct me wrongly and waste my time and gas money. I've changed the
settings, and done all the things needed, and it's proven to be worst
than useless. I've used it for the last time. I've been driving
about 40 years and will use paper maps as I have always done. No more
GPS for me. It's become nothing but a source of annoyance.
Before I sell it, I want to remove all my personal data such as my
"Home" and all the "archives" of recent trips. In other words, I want
to set it back to factory defaults. Is this possible? How? Do I
need to remove the batteries, or let them totally discharge, or is
there another way?

I don't know the Garmin. My first and only GPS is a TomTom and I am
happy to be able to say that this GPS is helping me a lot driving in the
part of Brasil where I am living: the state of Minas Gerais. The maps
are very reliable. I don't need another GPS.